The Subject of Soul **spoiler**

[Fortescue]

This isn't a very good title for the thread, but was trying to be discreet :rolleyes:

The new concept of Horcruxes was introduced in HBP. As explained in Harry's final lesson with Dumbledore, Voldemort split his soul into seven individual pieces - placing six of those pieces in other objects in order to insure his immortality.

This would explain why he didn't care about the fact that in SS/PS, Quirrell drank unicorn blood, which according to the centaur would only lead to a cursed life - since his life was cursed the moment he split his soul.

So now Harry's mission is to find the remaining Horcruxes and destroy them, then destroy Voldemort. Without all the objects Voldemort placed the bits of his soul in, regardless of what Harry does to Voldemort and his body, Voldemort can again, come back to life as he did in GoF.

Dumbledore gave Harry his account of what objects he thought Voldemort had placed the bits of his soul in:

1. Tom Riddle's diary - destroyed by Harry
2. Slytherin's ring - destroyed by Dumbledore
3. Slytherin's necklace - still missing ----taken by R.A.B
4. Hufflepuff's cup - still missing
5. Nagini - with Voldemort
6. **unknown
7. Voldemort himself

So far we have been shown that two of the Horcruxes have been destroyed, one by Harry and one, Dumbledore destroyed at a cost.

The third Horcrux was removed by R.A.B from the cave - this would have to obviously be, Sirius's brother, Regulus, and would be a big reason why he was killed.

We can assume then that the Horcrux was removed by Regulus and is possibly hidden in Grimmauld Place, of which we now know Harry to be the rightful owner. If this is the case, will Harry realize that the third Horcrux could possibly still be in Grimmauld Place? I don't think Voldemort would have hidden a bit of his soul in another person, as people can easily be killed, thus the bit of soul lost.

How might Harry find the location of Hufflepuff's cup?

How will Harry be able to kill Nagini?

Where is the sixth Horcrux hidden and in what?

Did Voldemort go with six or seven splits of his soul?

Any thoughts - opinions?

[kaz]

I think it is possible that Voldy passed a part of his soul on the Harry untentionally when he tried to kill him. He passed on alot as we all ready know...Im thinking the scar.....:)

[Fortescue]

Looking back on the story to this point, and the fact that if he did split his soul into seven individual bits prior to his attack on Harry, we now know Dumbledore's take on where and what the bits might be hidden in.

I just thought of the missing sixth clue could lie in the fact that when Voldemort attacked Harry and should have been killed, that would account for the sixth bit of his soul that Dumbledore didn't account for - Voldemort has already used one of his lives so there should only be the two remaining objects, and Nagini, Harry needs to find - that is, if Voldemort only split his soul into seven bits and not more. :rolleyes:

[Sirius-fan-forever]

I think that makes sense. If you go with dumbledore's words that voldemort made 7 horcruxes, then when he tried to kill Harry, one of them died. The second one destroyed was Riddles diary and the third voldemort destroyed by destroying the slytherin ring. So that should leave four, right? One he has in his body, one in nagini, one in the hufflepuff cup and last one in the locket/necklace. So technically, we got them all covered. I was under the impression from reading the book that we were missing one still. But if you count voldemort possesing one horcrux when he attacked Harry then that one should be destroyed. Since all the objects were found somewhere significant to voldemort. I think Harry may need to review all he knows about him in addition to finding out new information. Then he can try and guess where the Hufflepuff is kept. As for the locket, if RAB is infact Regulus Black then Grimmauld Place is definitely the best spot (but didn't RAB say he would destroy it before he dies....unless he didn't get around to doing it before voldemort killed him, in which case voldemort might have it and it's not at Grimmauld place but hidden somewhere else) :confused: . I still don't understand how dumbledore did not know that one of horcuxes was destroyed when voldemort attacked Harry. He told Harry to keep searching for the seventh object. I dunno if this is a twist or a mistake on J.K's part. Ok not a very well written post...lol...but that's what I have so far :o

[Fortescue]

Dumbledore also mentioned that he didn't believe Voldemort was aware of the horcruxes that had been destroyed, so Harry can do his work, as long as he continues to keep the secret from everyone except Ron and Hermione as to what he's up to, as we saw at the end, he didn't even tell McGonagall when she asked. He could keep destroying them and then surprise Voldemort with the fact that all his souls bits are gone. Although, Voldemort might be aware of the one Harry destroyed in the diary as Malfoy knows the story and surely told Voldemort.

[Tonks]

Well, first off, I don't really think it's safe to assume that R.A.B. really is Regulus Black and that that Horcrux is hidden at Grimmauld Place.. I'll stop there about that though, because that is being discussed elsewhere..

Ok, so I think that there are a total of 7 Horcruxes, Voldemort included. I included a quote from HBP just because..
Half-Blood Prince - Ch. 23: Horcruxes (U.S. version p. 506)
"The snake?" said Harry, startled. "You can use animals as Horcruxes?"
"Well, it is inadvisable to do so," said Dumbledore, "because to confide a part of your soul to something that can think and move for itself is obviously a very risky business. However, if my calculations are correct, Voldemort was still at least one Horcrux short of his goal of six when he entered your parents' house with the intention of killing you.
"He seems to have reserved the process of making Horcruxes for particularly significant deaths. You would certainly have been that. He believed that in killing you, he was destroying the danger the prophecy had outlined. He believed he was making himself invincible. I am sure that he was intending to make his final Horcrux with your death.
"As we know, he failed. After an interval of some years, however, he used Nagini to kill an old Muggle man, and it might then have occurred to him to turn her into his last Horcrux. She underlines the Slytherin connection, which enhances Lord Voldemort's mystique; I think he is perhaps as fond of her as he can be of anything; he certainly likes to keep her close, and he seems to have an unusual amount of control over her, even for a Parselmouth."
"So," said Harry, "the diary's gone, the ring's gone. The cup, the locket, and the snake are still intact, and you think there might be a Horcrux that was once Ravelclaw's or Gryffindor's?"
"An admirably succincy and accurate summary, yes," said Dumbledore, bowing his head.
I really think that the "unknown" one that Forte has listed as number 6 is probably an artifact of Ravenclaw's, as according to Dumbledore, the only known artifact ever owned by Gryffindor that still survives today is the sword which has been safe in Dumbledore's Office since Harry found it in CoS.

I think that Harry may kill Nagini last, as she is the one Horcrux that will almost definitely be with Voldemort (would've been nice if Arthur could've gotten her in OotP), and as such he might kill her right before he gets Voldemort himself. However, he may not and may kill Nagini during a confrontation where he yet again escapes, but Voldemort remains "alive".

[Nimue]

i have to say the idea that harry has part of voldy's soul is very popular. but seriously guys, he has to destroy the horcruxes. if harry had part of voldy's soul he'd have to destroy himself and then he wouln't be able to kill voldy. i dunno. someone else say something :o

[kashlie]

I suggested that Harry collects the Horcuxes so he destroy Voldemort all at once, including the Horcrux he has within himself. Of course, I could go on to say that the scar is the Horcrux - one made unintentionally, so Harry won't actually die, but the scar will be ripped from his head in the most unpleasant way imaginable.

The other thought I had was that the number 12 has been very prominent, so what if he started with 7, but just couldn't stop (like an addiction)? Or, perhaps, he has resumed his soul-splitting ways since his rebirth, knowing that at least one has been destroyed.

[Tonks]

You know, it's kind of twisted to think that Harry himself is a Horcrux. :o .. I really wouldn't have a problem with it, if it weren't for that part in GoF when Harry is at the Burrow and thinks he is being possessed.. but Ginny tells him there is no way he is being possessed. I think if he were a Horcrux, he would definitely know it, because he has a part of someone else's soul in there! Maybe in OotP I would have believed this, due to all the stuff Harry saw going on with Voldemort via dreams and the like, but now that Dumbledore has told him that is just a connection via the scar and that Voldemort is employing Occlumency, I think it unlikely.

Also, I have a feeling that to destry the Horcrux inside an object, the entire thing itself must be destroyed. I'm not completely sure about this because of something about the ring (which I'm off to start another thread on in a bit), but if that is true, then Harry would basically have to kill himself to take down Voldemort - and I just can't see that happening..

I really do think Voldemort would have stuck with 7. He mentioned the number seven to Slughorn himself, so I don't think he would decide to change it afterwards..

[Alz]

You know Harry as a Horcrux is actually a fantastic piece of work!
You know JKR hints that Harry might not survive - so it is possible he realises that he has to die in order that the final horcrux can not be used ...
I hear the words in my head 'Neither can live while the other survives ...' As in both cannot live while the other (last Hocrux) exisits ... because in essence it isnt going to happen - one or the other has to die - both can't live while the other survives - do you get it?

[Fortescue]

I wouldn't put it past her killing off Harry considering what she's already done, :mad:

But, I think Harry's dying in the end would be a bit much, and would probably take the books off the children's classics list. I think JKR's murdered enough of the good guys.

Tonks said that maybe a Ravenclaw object is a hocrux as JKR said that in book 7, Ravenclaw house would get a good bit of glory, so it's possible that is the final one and Harry just needs to find it.

[kashlie]

The propechy means neither Harry nor Voldemort can live while the Horcrux in Harry survives? I still think it is the scar, so Harry need not die in order to be rid of the Horcrux. JKR did say the scar was important, after all (although I did think she'd be clearing that up in HBP). I think Harry was made a Horcrux accidentally.

What if he had made the bones of his father a Horcrux? He had to get something back at his rebirth because the soul he was left with wasn't much at all. But then, he also used Harry's blood, and I doubt Wormtail was a Horcrux. What if Voldemort already has one bit of his soul back?

If not, it also makes sense for a Ravenclaw object to have been used. So far, Ravenclaw have remained pretty quiet. Hufflepuff lost Cedric, Slytherin...well, have had their fair share, as has Gryffindor, obviously.
Well, let us hope it was a Ravenclaw object and not Harry!!

[Alz]

What does make me wonder is - if say Harry is a Horcrux, Nagini is one - and obviously Voldemort has some soul left - you would have thought that Voldemort would do all he could to avoid Harry!
I mean in this one place with all three people there it could bring about his downfall - exactly the opposit reason of why he decided to go with the Horcruxes!
Given that assumption - I would negate Harry as a Horcrux and say there is a third one somewhere ...

[kashlie]

That is why I was thinking it was accidental. I don't believe for one minute that Voldemort would make an alive person a Horcrux - dead father, maybe, but if Harry is one, it was accidental when he did the AK and it rebounded. I figure the soul was ripped from his body - maybe it was split too, some of it disappeared, the other bit absorbed by Harry. In fact, Harry probably absorbed some of his mother's soul while he was at it, hence having her eyes....

[Fortescue]

I'm going to go back on Blaise's old adage about how corny (think heir of Gryffindor) ;) it would be if Harry's scar was a Horcrux and in the end he had to die to in order for Voldemort to be gone forever.....

The only way he could have made Harry a Horcrux is if he did it before the attack and that makes no sense because why would he put a bit of his soul into Harry just to then kill him?

I think he already used one of his soul bits when he survived the attack on Harry. I don't know how or where he got it from unless he had a spare on him at the time, but I find it far fetched to think that Harry would have to die in the end in order to vanquish Voldemort.

[Alz]

He had no idea that he would be killed when he attacked Harry - ergo he wasnt thinking about the piece of soul inside of him ...
I think he may have been faced with a choice - he knew that Harry has the power to kill him - so he might have thought - well I have 2 Horcrux here - chances are at least one will save me if indeed the unthinkable happens, on the upside, at least I can take out Harry Potter in the process ...
As long as he lived - then he was going to be happy - afterall he made the 7 horcruxes surely on the basis he would loose at least one or two along the way - but as long as he had life, he was happy ...

[Fortescue]

Yep, I agree completely, he had no idea he wouldn't be successful when he attacked Harry. He told his Death Eaters in the graveyard that he had underestimated the situation. I can only wonder how the Horcruxes could have helped him once he shot the curse at Harry and then lost his body. At that point, he couldn't do magic as he couldn't hold a wand. What is the process to transfer a soul bit from a Horcrux so that he can use it? He must have to carry a spare on him at all times since he obviously can't go running off to caves and such if he is mortally wounded or just a mist. I guess how the soul bit in a Horcrux actually works and what is required of Voldemort to use it is still a mystery.

[NeoSuperman]

Okay lets try to get this straight since I'm a bit confused. These are the "supposed" Horcruxes:

1: The Riddle Diary (Destroyed)
2: The Ring (Destroyed)
3: The Old Voldemort (Destroyed)
4: The New Voldemort
5: The Locket (Owned by R.A.B.)
6: The Hufflepuff Cup
7: A Gryffindor or Ravenclaw item

Are they not? Didn't Dumbledore say near the end that he didn't think Voldemort would use a living creature, not even Nagini? I might be wrong, so if I am please correct me.

[Fortescue]

Dumbledore said that the only relic of Gryffindor that he knew of was the sword in his office. Hopefully this doesn't all go back to my assumption that Harry is the heir to Gryffindor, thus he is the 'other' Gryffindor relic and the scar could actually be a Horcrux. :( Think, step aside silly girl.....

[NeoSuperman]

Or wait, I got it wrong above. Is it like this:

1: The Riddle Diary (Destroyed)
2: The Ring (Destroyed)
3: Voldemort
4: Nagini
5: The Locket (Owned by R.A.B.)
6: The Hufflepuff Cup
7: A Gryffindor or Ravenclaw item

[kashlie]

In the beginning of HBP, at Snape's home, Bellatrix is defending her relationship with Voldemort, and begins to say 'in the past he has trusted me with his most precious...' but Snape interupts.
Did Bellatrix have one of the Horcruxes? What if RAB had the locket, but Bellatrix got it back and held on to it, under Voldemort's orders?

[Somnia_Veritas]

Did Bellatrix have one of the Horcruxes? What if RAB had the locket, but Bellatrix got it back and held on to it, under Voldemort's orders?

And what if the safest place she thought she could keep it was in a certain glass case inside the Black family home? ;)

I had an odd brainfart relating to the death of Aragog. I don't think that JKR would just throw that in there for the heck of it... it MEANS something. So I was up too late one night last week and came up with this theory that Snape killed Aragog with a slow-acting poison to test its efficacy, planning to use it on Nagini once he got close enough to do so. Why poison? I don't think that AK'ing his snake would go down too well; it'd be far too direct and Voldy could Priori Incantato everyone's wands until he found out who did it, even if he couldn't read it from their minds. But a slow acting poison that mimicked a long debilitating disease would be rather difficult to prove, especially if the person who did it is a really good occlumens. Which brings us back to the million dollar question... what could Snape do that would get him close enough to Voldy to poison his little pet snake? Use the Vow he'd made for all it was worth, probably with Dumbledore's blessing. There's no way that Harry alone would be able to get near enough to Voldy to kill Nagini, not that I can think of, because even if he polyjuiced himself into one of Voldy's most trusted Death Eaters, Harry STILL sucks at Occlumency. (Who else found it odd that one of the last things Snape did was to make another dig at Harry's Occlumency skills, "encouraging" him to keep his mouth and his mind shut tight?)

But, like I said, I was up too late. Caffeine. Sugar. And a hope that Snape isn't quite so evil as he seems, even if he's not a nice person. yes.