Snape is Good

[Weasleyfanforever]

OK, in order to maintain some sort of order on this subject, the staff has decided to split the discussions on Snape's goodness/evilness into two seperate threads, much like the "Dumbledore is Evil" or "Dumbledore is Good" threads. These will be the only threads where the questions of Snape's loyalties and his goodness or evilness will be discussed. You may discuss other aspects of Snape on the site, such as his motivations, his childhood, etc; but if it deals with where his loyalties lie, it will be in the thread it's subject pertains to.

Also, we ask that you put as much thought, and canon research in your posts as possible. "Because I don't like him" or "Because I think so" posts will be removed.

We look forward to you bringing forth all the information you can to prove your own points! :D

[Caledaravel]

I'm not sure if even Snape really knows what side he is on. It would seem, however, that as of Book 4, Snape was still on Dumbledore's side. When Voldemort catalogues the Death Eaters at the Little Hangleton cemetery in GoF, we know that there is only one loyal servant at Hogwarts, whom we later find out is Barty Crouch, Jr. Of course, this could lead to some debate as to whether or not Barty Crouch, Jr. was the loyal servant to whom he was referring. Also, if Snape were truly evil, this would call into question his motivation for saving Harry from Quirrell's jinx during that game of Quidditch in SS/PP. We only know what Dumbledore's conclusion was: that Snape was saving Harry to hate James' memory in peace.

Despite the fact that I posted this in the "Re: Snape is Good" thread, it could just as easily point to Snape being evil. Such is the ambiguity of J.K. Rowling ... :p

[Nagini]

I think he is a goodie :D I didn't when I first read HBP - I called him bad names. :o But on my second reading of it, I saw some things that my now "look for clues" brain saw to be possible speculation that might point towards Snape being good.

The first of these was Snape saving Dumbledore's life when he destroyed the Horcruxe in the ring. Why bother to save him?

The second was when Dumbledore and Snape were overheard to be arguing by Hagrid. I think this was Snape telling Dumbledore that he didn't want to continue being a double spy, that he wanted to stop working for Voldemort. I think this was because Snape had worked out what Malfoy's mission was and realising he had taken the Unbreakable Vow and what the ramifications for could be.

I think Dumbledore also knew and being the couragous old goat that he is or was insisted that Snape continue. I don't think Dumbledore valued his own life very much.

[Sirius Potter Fan]

I have to agree with Nagini to start. I was nearly outraged my first reading. . . I mean how could he! I had supported his "goodness" from the start! Then after going back over, and really looking at key passages, I saw the truth! Snape was willing to start the vow, didn't have a choice really, but he hesitated significantly when it came down to the third vow, to finishe it if Draco didn't, he didn't wan't to, but he was stuck. There are many other reasons from other books that I need to check before I post, so for now I leave it with the most recent evidence. . . while running for the Hogwarts gates pursued by Harry, even though he couldn't kill him because Voldemort wanted to do that, Snape could have easily paralized him as Dumbledore did, and taken him to Voldemort, but he not only didn't do it, he never even tried, he only deflected Harry's spells.

[Weasleyfanforever]

One passage in the book that really gets me is this one:

"Blocked again and again and again until you learn to keep your mouth shut and your mind closed, Potter!"

then a few lines down:

"No!" roared Snape's voice and the pain stopped as suddenly as it had started; Harry lay curled on the dark grass, clutching his wand and panting; somewhere overhead Snape was shouting, "Have you forgotten our orders? Potter belongs to the Dark Lord - we are to leave him! Go! Go!"

To me, the first part sounds like advice, like Snape is compelling him to remember that he won't be able to beat any of them if he can't keep his mind and his mouth shut.

The second is intriguing to me, because we know that Voldemort wants to kill Potter, but why not, as has been said before, stupefy him and bring him along? Why let him go? Possibly, Snape will be able to use the fact that Buckbeak attacked him as a cover-up for not getting Harry....

[Alz]

I think Snape realises that Harry is in a big boys game - major league - as such he has always employed tough love to make Harry really understand and remember ..
Harry hates Snape - always has - as such each time Snape talks to Harry - Harry remembers it - by Snape reducing Harry to the point of ridicule it ensure that Harry tries his best to prove Snape wrong ... tough mentor ...

Snape needed to stop the DE's just landing Harry - I mean any one of them could have AK Harry as he was trained on Snape - he wasn't aware of anything else what was going on - as such Snape panicked and made the call ... that might have got back to Voldemort that Snape stopped the DE's attacking Harry - as such his recovery wasn't smooth but it was effective - enough for plausible denial when he is back with Voldemort ...

There isn't any doubts in my mind that Snape is good - I love to argue back and forth and will continue to - but my pin is where it has been since I first picked up a Potter book - in fact go read the posts - Snape is looking out for Harry ... ;)

[Nagini]

"Blocked again and again and again until you learn to keep your mouth shut and your mind closed, Potter!"

Thanks for posting that up Wheezy mate, I also looked at it and wondered if perhaps it was advice like you said. What if Snape is telling Harry something - "blocked again and again and again". Is he perhaps saying to Harry that Snape's mind is blocked to Harry until he learns to close his mind too?

Perhaps Snape will reveal all to Harry in order to bridge some trust between them but only if Harry learns to close his mind - otherwise Snape could be found out if Voldemort etc. attempted to read Harry's mind.

As for Snape looking out for Harry - I never liked that, I do believe he dislikes Harry anyway because he reminds him so much of his father, but Snape knows he has to choose sides, either choose Harry who could defeat the Dark Lord (Snape may well have heard the whole prophecy from Dumbledore) or bring down Harry.

I think Voldemort gave orders for Harry not to be touched as he has bigger plans for him - everyone of those Death Eaters had ample time to kill him, they could have went for both Harry and Dumbledore and scored a record victory but Voldemort isn't like that. He wouldn't have wanted someone to do what he alone must do. Voldemort believes in the prophecy.

[Weasleyfanforever]

This point was brought to my attention when talking to a friend of mine who had just finished HBP. I think she caught on to something I might have never noticed :p

Do Felix Felicis and Snape have a connection? Professor Slughorn is quoted as saying that FF “will find that all your endeavors tend to succeed”. We also know that Ron, Hermione, and Ginny drank FF the night Dumbledore died. We also know that Ron says “I messed up, Harry,” and tells Harry how he let Draco and the DE pass. How could this have happened? Ron drank liquid luck, and if taken at face value, this is a very unlucky thing to have happened. Hermione also laments how she was stupid not to see that Snape had stupefied Flitwick. How could Felix Felicis have not helped her, when she was supposed to be waiting to see if Snape would betray the Order?

I propose that Felix Felicis was working to help them out, they just didn't know it.

Lets say, for arguments sake, that Dumbledore knew about the Unbreakable Vow, and he knew that he was going to be killed by either Snape or Draco for them to live. He orders Snape to kill him when the time arose. If this is how it was, then Snape did not betray the Order, and the seeming not working of the Felix Felicis fits in perfectly. Hermione wouldn’t have tried to stop Snape because he was on her side the whole time, and Ron couldn't stop Draco and the DE for a similar reason, it would go against the plan that Dumbledore and Snape had.

I know it's an out there idea, but we also know that Felix Felicis works, it is proven by Harry taking it and getting the memory from Slughorn. So if Ron and Hermione really did screw up, then it makes no sense at all. If we believe that Felix Felicis works, we have to believe that Snape is good.

[Alz]

That is a great theory - I like it a lot!!
Maybe even worth a thread on it's own - I mean yeah I missed all of that and you are right!