View Full Version : Hagrid's Flight!
Tinkerbell
18-12-2004, 03:47
In Chapter 5, Diagon Alley in PS/SS, Hagrid tells Harry that he "flew" to pick him up from the island on his birthday, but that they had to take the boat back - how did he fly? On what? What happened to it?
We are told later in the Septology that Hagrid would be too big to get on a broom, so what on earth was he flying on, or did he just glide...!!
That is odd and a real puzzle. There was a storm that night making it almost impossible to think that anyone would be flying in that.
But if Hagrid did fly would he have used magic? Could he have used that level of magic?
I know its unlikely but perhaps he took Sirius' motorbike and somehow crashed it or for reasons unknown, left it there and took the boat back?
I was also thinking that it could have been the motorbike, but we also know about lots of flying creatures at Hogwarts, namely Hippogriffs and Thestrals. Perhaps he took one of those creatures over and it left him there so as not to cause any Muggle disturbance . . .
Oh good pick up Boing! I had forgotten that Hagrid would have had access to the Thestrals and Hippogriffs. Perhaps he sent the thestral/hippogriff back as Harry would have not been allowed to travel by magic however its means and that is why they took the boat?
Tinkerbell
18-12-2004, 12:39
Good one Boing!
Perhaps he took a Thestral and then sent it back to Hogwarts when he took Harry in the boat - because at that stage neither Harry nor anyone else would have been able to see the Thestral!
Ummm, you know that is another great point!
Yah I kinda agree - it might have been a Thestral or Hippogriff - but just seems really obscure that what he arrived with he couldnt re-use ...
What about a Portkey?
Would that class as flying - because I always thought of them as a one way deal ...
Either that or perhaps Dumbledore cast a special spell on Hagrid that allowed him to fly - so he could get about easier trying to track Harry - but because Hagrid cant do magic he wasnt able to reuse it?
Pshhttt - can't anyone see him pulling a Superman? ;)
I think a Portkey is my favorite idea here, because its something that can just be discarded and left there. The weather was pretty gross that night, and I don't think it would've been too great weather for taking a broomstick or flying thestrals or hippogriffs or anything.
Can you just tell a thestral to go somewhere and they'll go? Or, can Hagrid, seeing as how he's got the only domesticated herd around?
I don't seem to remember the kids really guiding the thestrals all that much in OotP, so perhaps you can just give them a destination and off they go. In that case, thestral might have been a good option for Hagrid, but I also like the idea of taking a Portkey. I'm sure that could have been authorized to get Harry Potter to school - at that point he was just famous, not a pain to the MoM!
Weasleyfanforever
19-12-2004, 22:53
I am really leaning towards Thesrals here. I think it would be the easiest for Hagrid to use, as he would less of a chance being seen than if he had come by broom. And although Dumbledore trusts Hagrid, I am not sure that the MoM would authorise a portkey for him to get Harry in PS/SS, as he was not known to be innocent of opeing the Chamber until CoS, so they might still have some qualms about him using magic of that caliber. I also think that Hagrid would be most comfortable going by thestral. He raised them himself, so he would be much more familiar with them than a magical object, as he didn't finish his magical education....
I guess I was thinking that Dumbledore or someone else would have set up the Portkey for Hagrid to use, not that Hagrid would have put the spell on the object himself. I don't think the MoM would have a problem with Hagrid using a Portkey, but now that you mention it, you're probably right that they would not have been too keen on Hagrid going to fetch Harry at all no matter what form of transportation . . .
Umm see I prefer portkey to Thestral ... but could a portkey be classed as 'flying'?
It would seem like a Thestral would have waited around for a lift back ... I mean it was just as dangerous to be stood around as what it would have been to fly back on it's own ... in fact would have been more use stood around ...
Perhaps Hagrid didnt think Harry was ready for the magical ways to travel and so decided to go for a more 'conventional' way so Harry didnt freak out that this Twice and tall and wide person comes and grabs him then shoves him onto an animal that would freak most people out - to then fly half way across England ;)
MissWhizbee
21-12-2004, 15:12
Or maybe Hag took a thestral there, but he is so big that there wouldn't have been room for harry to ride on the same one and he didn't think harry could ride one by himself so he decided to take the boat back and send the thestral back to hogwarts on its own.
In a simplist kind of way that works as well :D
Would fit in with that he 'flew' there and got a boat back ...
In fact seems logical as well :o
Hagrid was too big to ride a thestral!! He has hands the size of dustpan lids...if the kids could get on and off the thestrals easily, then Hagrid would have squished it!
I think a portkey is more likely, because Harry heard only slight sounds outside (the motorbike would have been loud). Safer in a storm too, to take a portkey.
But what I don't get, is that Hagrid belived Harry knew all about Hogwarts and the wizarding world. Did he assume that Harry wouldn't know what a portkey was, so just said he flew?
I have a feeling the ministry was not aware of Hagrid's mode of transport, because he had been expelled so not allowed to use magic...all though if they were aware, it would explain why there was no return trip, coz Hagrid couldn't set up a portkey legally...
I vote portkey, but only coz I feel sorry for the thestrals if he rode one!
Or, LOL, did he do a Mary Poppins and use his umbrella?
the other thing - how did DD expect Hagrid to deliver Harry to the Dursleys? He and McGonagall were surprised to see Hagrid on the motorbike...
In response to Kashlie's question about how Dumbledore thought Hagrid would get there - there are several options, but I think that it was probably not a Portkey or something like that. A Portkey would have been the fastest way other than apparating and Hagrid chose the motorbike that Sirius offered to him, so he obviously figured the motorbike would be the best of the options he had.
I think the surprise comes from the fact that it was Sirius's motorbike. I have to imagine that there aren't too many enchanted motorbikes in the wizarding world, so Dumbledore would have known where it came from - he was surprised because he thinks Sirius was the one who betrayed the Potters and then he sees Hagrid ride up on his motorbike . . .
Um, maybe, if the thestral could have carried Hagrid, then it could have still been there. Remember, at this point, Harry couldn't see the thestrals, so for Hagrid to want Harry to get on something he couldn't see...well, that'd be stupid!
I still think he is too big to ride one, but maybe they are stronger than I give them credit for.
And can anyone tell me why the Thestral is not in Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them?
Sirius Potter Fan
06-05-2005, 07:04
And can anyone tell me why the Thestral is not in Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them?
(on that one, I think it is because JKR probably wrote that mini book before OotP, and she either hadn't thought of them yet, or it could also be if that she didn't want to give away the "secret" of the Thestrals before OotP, or we wouldn't be woried that Harry was "seeing things")
My vote on Hagrid's transportation is definately for Thestrals (yes notice the plural) I believe he may have been carried by two, carying him in a sling or something of the sort, I doubt too that he could have fit atop one. But Thestrals make sense on several levels.
They are quiet
They are invisible (to most, especialy in this context to Harry)
They could return to the forest on their own
They would have been able to "track" Harry efficiently as the Dursleys moved about by a simple comand like "Find Harry Potter"
A portkey would be a possibility, but like Blaise, I really don't see portkeys classified as "flying"
One final observation/question for you...
How did the Dursley's get off the island? Hagrid and Harry took the boat! ;)
You think the sight of a rather large gentlemen floating in the air in a semi sling might not have looked a bit suspect?
I mean as said above - thestrals are invisible to most people and if they were looking to scare Harry half to death then that might have been a possible means of transport.
I still think Hagrid took conventional means to get there - just in case he was spotted by a Muggle or something - and I think Dumbledore was keen to give Harry a gentle welcome to the world of the magical.
Fortescue
07-05-2005, 03:43
I'm betting on the motorbike. JKR hinted that it would come up again. We haven't seen where it has been all this time, but it is magical, and I would assume could make the return trip by itself. The night was quite noisy with the wind howling and the rain pounding outside the hut on the rock. It was definitely loud enough to cover up the sound of the motorbike.
"The storm raged more and more ferociously as the night went on."
"Five minutes to go. Harry heard something creak outside. He hoped the roof wasn't going to fall in, although he might be warmer if it did."
"Three minutes to go. Was that the sea, slapping hard on the rock like that? And (two minutes to go) what was that funny crunching noise? Was the rock crumbling into the sea?" (SS/PS pg 45 US)
These are the only clues to the sounds prior to Hagrid's pounding on the door. I don't know what the creaking might have been; possibly Hagrid getting of the bike and the shocks giving a sigh of relief :D
Sirius Potter Fan
07-05-2005, 06:35
You think the sight of a rather large gentlemen floating in the air in a semi sling might not have looked a bit suspect?
I mean as said above - thestrals are invisible to most people and if they were looking to scare Harry half to death then that might have been a possible means of transport.
I still think Hagrid took conventional means to get there - just in case he was spotted by a Muggle or something - and I think Dumbledore was keen to give Harry a gentle welcome to the world of the magical.
OK, I don't think it likely that he would have been seen, and we definately know that he flew...(*picturing Hagrid riding coach on an airliner* :eek: ) on either the motorbike or on the thestrals, I don't think he would have been seen. Remember it was a verry stormy night, and from what we read in OotP, we know that the Thestrals can fly at very high altitudes, high enough to be a meer speck in the sky, not to mention that they likely could have flown above the clouds completely. And although we don't know how high the motorbike could fly, it is possible that it could go as high as well. Remember in OotP when the kids flew to the ministry on the thestrals? It was broad daylight, and they aparantly weren't seen, as it wasn't mentioned. Also the guard and Harry, at the begining of the book flying high on their brooms, and at night, so not to be seen.
Fort... I hadn't thought about the bike being able to return itself, but you are right, if the enchanted Ford could, why not the motor bike! I think both thestrals and the bike are possible solutions. Hagrid had easy access to both, and it would make sense, and a little continuity for Hagrid to use the same bike to rescue Harry from the Dursleys, as he used to take Harry there in the first place.
BUT...I however still lean towards the Thestrals. I mean, all other things being equal...thestrals are ugly terrifying possibly dangerous magical beasts...what would Hagrid choose? :D
Yeah, you know, i definitely have to support the thestral argument here.. In OotP when they were flying to the Ministry, didn't they only have 2 or 3 between the six of them? I dont think its all that surprising that one would be able to hold Hagrid's weight..
I agree with SPF that i doubt he would be seen, especially since Thestrals are invisible.. aside from the weather, it was about midnight so its not like millions of people would be out and about.. And since Hagrid trained the Hogwarts thestrals himself, I bet he could have landed and just sent it back because he knew he would have to take the boat now that he had Harry..
I bet thestrals aren't in Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them because JKR just didn't want to give away a potential secret about there being any at Hogwarts to any really interested fans before OotP came out. She's said that she has the whole story planned out already, so i dont think it was an issue about not having them thought up yet - unless she hadn't figured out all the exact details...
Maybe the creak Harry heard was just the hut creaking in the storm.. or Hagrid stepping onto some form of dilapidated front step or something - Im sure that would probably creak..
As for the Dursleys, maybe the guy who let them use the hut saw the boat on the land, figured it must have gotten loose in the storm, and went out and got them? Darn, that would've been convenient if they'd stayed marooned out there and died of hunger.. shame..
I think the surprise comes from the fact that it was Sirius's motorbike. I have to imagine that there aren't too many enchanted motorbikes in the wizarding world, so Dumbledore would have known where it came from - he was surprised because he thinks Sirius was the one who betrayed the Potters and then he sees Hagrid ride up on his motorbike . . .
I know this is alittle off topic, but Hagrid et al couldn't have suspected Sirius of the betrayal at the beginning of the story. Hagrid told Dumbledore he was returning the bike to Sirius as he left Privet Drive.
“Yeah,” said Hagrid in a very muffled voice, “I’ll be takin’ Sirius his bike back. G’night, Professor McGonagall -- Professor Dumbledore, sir.”
sorry -- back to the topic ---
Fortescue
07-05-2005, 10:42
I know this is alittle off topic, but Hagrid et al couldn't have suspected Sirius of the betrayal at the beginning of the story. Hagrid told Dumbledore he was returning the bike to Sirius as he left Privet Drive.
sorry -- back to the topic ---
But it's been pointed out that there is a plot hole regarding the motorbike. In SS/PS, after dropping off Harry at the Dursley's, Hagrid tells Dumbledore that he has to take the motorbike back to Sirius, but in PoA, he tells Fudge, McGonagall, Flitwick and Madam Rosmerta that before he left Godric's Hollow with Harry, Sirius told him to keep the motorbike because he wouldn't be needing it anymore. So actually, he didn't take the bike back to Sirius.
In OotP, there was one thestral for each person. They didn't share them. I don't think a thestral could hold Hagrid any better than a hippogriff or a broomstick could.
EDIT: There's a passage someplace where Hagrid talks about not being able to ride a broom and such because of his size, but my foggy brain can't remember where it's at right now. If I find it I'll post it later. I'll let my brain go rest now :D
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