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Old 05-12-2004, 04:10   #1
Tinkerbell
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Links to another children's favourite?

Wasn't sure whether to put this thread here or in wild speculation! Will leave it with our trusty staff to move it if they feel it necessary!

As many of you know, I have a fascination with the story of Peter Pan (as well as with HP!), and having recently seen yet another version of the movie, was struck by a line by Peter Pan, and it's similarity with a line from PS/SS.

Whilst in a sword fight with Captain Hook, when Hook gets the upper hand (or shouild that be the upper hook?!) Peter Pan says

"death would be an awfully big adventure"


and.... yes, you can see what's coming can't you!

Dumbledore says, in PS/SS:

"...to the well organised mind, death is but the next great adventure."

So, bearing in mind that PS/SS was JKR's first in the Septology, do you think she has linked the words of J M Barrie who was also a man who had a very vivid imagination, with the ever present elements of time and magic within the world of Potter?!

Any comments!?
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Old 05-12-2004, 07:10   #2
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Re: Links to another children's favourite?

Think you may be going at a bit too much of a tangent - but there is also the similarity around eternal life / living in HP and Peter Pan being an eternal child, but I really cant think of any more. The was no secret to PP being a child forever - he lived in Neverland - whereas the PS is needed in HP. Im sure there will be more similarities, but cant say Ive studied PP too hard
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Old 05-12-2004, 10:17   #3
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Re: Links to another children's favourite?

You know what - that is actually a bit insightful!

Clarice made the point about the boy who lived forever - well we can adapt that quite nicely to Potter - look no further than Voldemort!
His mortality is paramount to him - he wants to survive and live forever ... Peter was the boy that never grew up!

The quote you made there does seem uncanny right ... I wonder ... ummm ...
I cant think what types of parallels JKR could be making ... if she is I wonder if she did it without any real comprehension?
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Old 05-12-2004, 12:45   #4
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Re: Links to another children's favourite?

I just felt that it was really interesting that someone who wrote about a boy who did not want to grow up, includes a line which refers to death as an adventure, whereas we have Harry, who knows by the time we get to OotP that he may have to die in order to defeat Voldemort (although of course is not so aware of this during PS/SS). The element of time travel within this is also interesting - in Peter Pan we have time standing still almost for a young boy who does not want to become an adult and endure the pains of adulthood, whereas a lot of the time Harry is having to grow up too quickly and take on adult tasks (i.e., defeating an evil wizard!) and not having too much time to try and experience a 'normal' childhood and adolescence.
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Old 06-12-2004, 12:43   #5
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Re: Links to another children's favourite?

See, I suppose I adapted what you were saying in a slightly different manner and also to a different person ...
I suppose I look at death and what it actually means to certain characters and that is what made me link in Voldemort ...
You POV is insightful as well ...
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Old 06-12-2004, 13:01   #6
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Re: Links to another children's favourite?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinkerbell
I just felt that it was really interesting that someone who wrote about a boy who did not want to grow up, includes a line which refers to death as an adventure, whereas we have Harry, who knows by the time we get to OotP that he may have to die in order to defeat Voldemort (although of course is not so aware of this during PS/SS). The element of time travel within this is also interesting - in Peter Pan we have time standing still almost for a young boy who does not want to become an adult and endure the pains of adulthood, whereas a lot of the time Harry is having to grow up too quickly and take on adult tasks (i.e., defeating an evil wizard!) and not having too much time to try and experience a 'normal' childhood and adolescence.
Yeah I like that... although Harry had to grow up very quickly living with the Dursleys and of course finding out that his parents were murdered and he ws famous. Whereas Peter Pan did not want to grow up and so he stayed a boy in Neverland.

Actually, sometimes I see a childish side to Voldemort too. He is evil undoubtly but the evil games he likes to play and the joy he takes out of playing them are like childish glee at times.

In the film The Mummy and also I think in the Mummy Returns they used the quote "Death is only the beginning". Although by then of course PS/SS had been published and was hugely sucessful.
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Old 06-12-2004, 18:04   #7
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Re: Links to another children's favourite?

(Good movies Gin )

As far as the link to Peter Pan goes, that is pretty neat, but I have a feeling its just a coincidence. I don't think she did it intentionally at all obviously, but probably without noticing anything of the sort.

I get the feeling that something along these lines could be mentioned in a lot of novels/movies as a bit of a common view towards death. There are many different types of characters out there that could see death in this particular way.
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Old 12-02-2007, 08:15   #8
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Re: Links to another children's favourite?

Actually I watched Hook last night with my husband and we both noticed the death is the only adventure part but as for Hook being Dumbledore and Peter Pan being Voldemort I should hope not but if you really want to stretch it that way then Voldemort(PP) through snape/draco killed Dumbledore(Hook) so i guess if you want to stretch it that way then.... I kind of like the Narnia version more myself-not that JKR made it like it but I think kids all like HP,Narnia, and Disney movies for the same reasons. Narnia for instance has the White Witch that ate the apple and lived a long long time until the children came and with the help of aslan killed her and restored peace to narnia. Still I dont think its the same, its just good to grab your attention and see who will win the ultimate battle of good and evil, all childrens storys do that I think.
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Old 12-02-2007, 21:37   #9
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Re: Links to another children's favourite?

i guess J.k is just saying that Voldemort doesn't have a 'well-organised mind'
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Old 13-02-2007, 14:22   #10
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Re: Links to another children's favourite?

So as to ensure my complete GEEK status, I pulled the book. Yes, it's sad, but true. I have a 7yo here, so she is my excuse. Anyhoo --- the movie Peter Pan to which you are all refering was released after SS/PS, so any quote might not be the same. As it turns out, it is a quote from the book. Here's the exact quote at the very end of chapter 7:

Quote:
Peter was alone. The rising water tapped at his toes, ready to claim him. Far off, the mermaids sang their doleful song to the moon. Peter stood. He was afraid. Then a faint smile crossed his lips, and he heard a drum beating within him. It was saying, "To die will be an awfully big adventure."
Man, that drum sounds a lot like Phoenix song to me. It bolsters Peter and gives him a positive outlook where it was frightening and dim. Because it is an iconic book and quite well read, I wouldn't be surprised at all if JKR "borrowed" any ideas from it. There are threads and blogs all over the internet linking HP to other such well-read literature (Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, as one other example). There is the hero's arc for stories that is well discussed here and on other sites, as well. So, is there a link? I wouldn't be surprised. I think it's worth discussing the actual text of the book(s) as it can't be dismissed out of hand that she didn't know it.

On another note, I love this movie -- mainly for Jason Isaacs, but it's a good movie, anyway. And, it follows the book fairly well. . . . which is good news for HP fans since the screenwriter for OotP is the same as the one who did this Pan movie.
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