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Discussions on Goblet of Fire "I don't know who put my name in the Goblet of Fire ..."

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Old 01-12-2004, 05:13   #21
Alz
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

Well, just for a little diversification on this - what if it was him?
I often wonder if Harry finds out the way Voldemort did his steps long ago - and perhaps took a few himself?
I know it is a little out there - but was a touch convienient that the portkey was reset back to safety and not sure the shadows could have messed with it - look at Voldemort when he lost his body ... it required someone with physical form and a wand ...
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Old 05-12-2004, 07:36   #22
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

Tough one... I agree that portkeys are one way trips - as we are told this in the book, so it has to be someone in the graveyard. I dont think it would be Pettigrew - too small a task for repayment of having his life spared by H. He is a scared man, and I feel he will pass a warning to H rather than physically assist when his life is in danger - surely a life for a life would have meant Pettegrew helping H at an earlier stage in the graveyard.
Snape - I really cant decide if he is good / bed. I tend to feel he is more good, and I dont think he would have gone to the graveyard (even if he is a double agent), if he is a good wizard now, he would remain at Hogwarts for protection of his life - going to meet volde would surely be the beginning of his end - and we know he was a bit of a sad kid at school. If he is still a DE, surely there would be more disruption / murders etc at Hogwarts. So no, I dont think it was him.
If anyone was aware that the cup became a portkey at the ttrwizard event, they couldnt have followed it to the graveyard could they??? They wouldnt have known where it was going (unless they arranged for it with Barty jnr).
It has to be someone at the graveyard that night, who - I dont know.
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Old 05-12-2004, 10:41   #23
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

I think if Pettigrew wanted to save Harry's life he would have ensured that Harry was never there ... he knew that Voldemort wanted to use him - as per first chapter of GoF - and he did try to get Voldemort to use someone else ... but also Voldemort was still weak and reliant on Pettigrew - so ultimatly he could have stopped him if he wanted to.

Voldemort called back all his DE's - and then makes the famous speech - I am actually torn if Snape was there or not - I always assumed he was but now question that recently based on a few people's comments ...
I still feel he stood the best chance and also had the motivation to try and help Harry - and we know he is a spy so could have been there ... could have!

So - who else?
Well I dont think JKR would pull a suprise DE to be on the other side - the only well known one would have been Malfoy ... and just dont think he would - he really hated Potter after what happened in CoS ...
Interesting - I really hope JKR addresses this one at some point!
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'Don't hurt them, don't hurt then, please, please, it's my fault, hurt me instead ...'
'Please, please, please, no ... not that, not that, I'll do anything ...'

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'Merely taking your life would not satisfy me..'
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Old 05-12-2004, 23:00   #24
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaise
I think if Pettigrew wanted to save Harry's life he would have ensured that Harry was never there ... he knew that Voldemort wanted to use him - as per first chapter of GoF - and he did try to get Voldemort to use someone else ... but also Voldemort was still weak and reliant on Pettigrew - so ultimatly he could have stopped him if he wanted to.
I have to agree with Blaise here. Peter could have stopped Voldemort from getting his body back all together, and he didn't do that, so I just can't see him changing the portkey back. I don't think he has the nerve to help Harry right in front of Voldemort, right after he has gotten his body back.

I really, really want the person that changed the Port Key back to be Snape. I think it is a good possibility that he did. I think if he had not been at the Circle that night, it would have meant that he couldn't return as a DE, and we are 99% sure that he is still a DE spy, or double spy, what have you. This is really out there, but what if Snape can make himself invisible, like Dumbledore can, without a cloak. It would have been easy for him to make himself invisible in the pandemonium, change back the Port Key, and either become visible again, or go back to Hogwarts with Harry, and Harry not even knowing he was there...
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Old 06-12-2004, 14:16   #25
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

Ummm - not sure that is a little out there
I dont think Snape would have resisted the temptation to be invisible in the books so far ... he really would have used it as well - especially when tracking Potter!

Are we right do you think to discount the likes of Malfoy from this puzzle?
I know he seems to really hate and loath Harry - but who better to do a mega twist ...

My other fav here is the man with magic no-one really understands - Dumbledore ... but some how that would be wild speculation ...
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'Please make it stop, I know I did wrong, oh, please make it stop and i'll never, never again..'
'Don't hurt them, don't hurt then, please, please, it's my fault, hurt me instead ...'
'Please, please, please, no ... not that, not that, I'll do anything ...'

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'Merely taking your life would not satisfy me..'
Dumbledore - OoTP "The only one he ever feared" Pg895
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Old 06-12-2004, 21:48   #26
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

I have heard theories that Malfoy is really a good guy, and that he is in the best position to undermine Voldemort, but one would think that if he were a good guy, he wouldn't have given the diary to Ginny in CoS. He would have been able to stop an attempt at LV rising again, and he didn't...

I think Dumbledore being the one that changed the portkey wouldn't be so far off. We know that he has the ability to make himself invisible without the use of a invisibility cloak, and we assume that he has done it before without Harry noticing that he was there (while looking at the Mirror of Erised.) Also, who was nearest, and I Am assuming first to Harry when he arrives back from the Graveyard? :

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoF
Then a pair of hands seized him roughly and turned him over.
"Harry! Harry!
He opened his eyes.
He was looking up at the starry sky, and Albus Dumbledore was crouched over him. The dark shadows of a crowd of people pressed in around them, pushing nearer; Harry felt the ground beneath his head reverberating with their footsteps.
Harry feels someone grab him and flip him over, then he opens his eyes to see Dumbledore. It would have been very easy for Dumbledore to become visible again, and shake Harry awake. Perhaps the glint in Dumbledore's eyes later in the book is from his remembering the scene. He looks at Harry's arm, because he was not close enough to see where they actually took the blood from, and he almost instantly knows what Harry is talking about when he explains Priori Incantatem.

My view on this would be that Dumbledore was invisible inside the maze, making sure no one was badly injured, watching over the events. He was poised by the Cup in case someone cheated if there was a close call, and he when Cedric and Harry grabbed the Cup, he did as well. It might have been his intention to reveal himself, but then the Cup was found to be a port key. I think this could be why Dumbledore believes Harry's story. Dumbledore is not stupid, it could have been because he was there....
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Old 05-03-2005, 11:35   #27
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weasleyfanforever
My view on this would be that Dumbledore was invisible inside the maze, making sure no one was badly injured, watching over the events. He was poised by the Cup in case someone cheated if there was a close call, and he when Cedric and Harry grabbed the Cup, he did as well. It might have been his intention to reveal himself, but then the Cup was found to be a port key. I think this could be why Dumbledore believes Harry's story. Dumbledore is not stupid, it could have been because he was there....

i dont agree with you WFF on this topic. because that must have been such an auspicious occassion for the school and hosting school's headmaster is missing!! obviously everyone can see that. and dumbledore is not a personality not to be missed easily.
secondly, my first thoughts were for the ghost/ shadows of harry's parents. but snape is also a good one. no i wont vote for peter, because if he wanted to pay the debt, he would have shown it to potter.
another thing, i just felt, that its good to discuss here.
in Gof they said, they have to be careful with the materials used as portkeys, so that muggles wouldnt go picking them up.
and also, arthur said, that portkeys are objects used to transport wizards from one place to another at a prearranged time.
if that's so, then y do they have to be careful with the materials where muggles are concerned.
also, then for the cup. if its already Pre arranged time, then how did moody know at what time harry is going to touch it.
because i also remember, amos diggory picked up the portkey and said, yes i have got it. now everyone should come closer and touch it. one finger will do....
this means that at that particular minute...... prearranged.
then what abt the cup in the labyrinth and in the graveyard too.....
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Old 30-03-2005, 13:46   #28
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

wow--but ok
1st I think the trophy/portkey was for a prearranged period--the graveyard escape--that was changed in advance or it was always for a return trip--if it was changed in front of the ghosts--that is how they saw it--but if it was always setuo for a return trip--the ghosts would have to be all knowing--or Bertha heard the info before her death
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Old 31-03-2005, 12:47   #29
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

Once again we have to refer to past - and a porkey being done after a trip ...
We saw them being discarded after use at the World Cup - as such I think unless someone used Portus on the cup again - it wasnt going anywhere ...
We can only judge on the past instances and I dont think to my knowledge we have seen a two way portkey - we have seen them discarded after one use.
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'Please make it stop, I know I did wrong, oh, please make it stop and i'll never, never again..'
'Don't hurt them, don't hurt then, please, please, it's my fault, hurt me instead ...'
'Please, please, please, no ... not that, not that, I'll do anything ...'

Dumbledore - HBP Pg536

'Merely taking your life would not satisfy me..'
Dumbledore - OoTP "The only one he ever feared" Pg895
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Old 31-03-2005, 16:33   #30
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Re: Who Changed the Portkey?

Interesting point about the prearranged time. Perhaps there are different spells to use - one that simply makes the Portkey a portkey for the first person to touch it and one that is for a specified time. It makes sense that there might be different ways of using the Portkeys.

Of course, this still doesn't tell us who changed it back . . . I wonder if we will ever find out because we haven't heard anything in OotP and that makes me worried that we never will. Also, Voldemort hasn't seemed to be angry about that or seek retribution for it, so perhaps he wasn't that surprised that it was a Portkey again (or perhaps this is evidence that they can go two ways - but then why would Moody make it a two-way Portkey?) Was Voldemort planning on using it to go back to Hogwarts and make a scene?
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