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Old 12-07-2007, 05:24   #11
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Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

Now I haven't read OoTP in a long time, let alone any of the other books, and the main part of the movie I was looking forward to was the first thing that got my attention in the book. Dumbledore telling Harry the prophecy and how Neville could possibly be whom the prophecy speaks of. I was expecting them to maybe spice that aspect up a little seeing as they could have used it to boost sales for the next movie.
I mean if I hadn't read the books I would have loved to have seen something like that in the end of the movie, leaving everyone hanging. It would have definantly made me want to go see the next one.

I think the movie was shocking. I mean, I had a friend with me who had never read the books and she was asking me what was going on because they didn't explain anything! It was definantly disappointing realizing that the person next to me had no idea what was going on for the simple fact that she has never read the books. Well. let me put it this way. She did know what was going on, but not the bigger picture. Not all the details and interesting facts that make Harry Potter what it is. Its was not a shallow book and that is how it is portrayed in the movie. Shallow!

I'm angry they didn't put Rita Skeeter's interview in. Kreacher's appearances were weak. They never explained if Sirius was dead, it was protrayed that you had to know what happened and what it was he fell into to even understand it. If I had seen that without reading the book, I would have thought he just fell into nothing, because they didn't explain. I would have been asking myself what it was. There was so much stuff I thought needed to go in that movie to make it better and I don't want to keep rambling because I will be here for hours.

Overall, I was very disappointed and I think I will never watch another movie of Harry Potter, I'll read its better for you. All I can say is that it would have been good for those who didn't care about the books and the way they are portrayed through film. They make the books and the story seem shallow and I think they could have done a better job. Heck, let me make the next movie!!!!
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Old 12-07-2007, 05:48   #12
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Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

I actually gasped out loud when Harry gave Lucius the prophesy. That was a major violation. They did skip things that we all know are central because either they turn up in book 6, JKR has told us they are central or they appear to be so because they look like they are on the cover of 7. Kreacher's role in causing Sirius' death comes to mind, as does the mirror from Sirius as good examples.

I was struck as well by Luna using a spell that she couldn't possibly know and she brings up the issue of whether or not sirius is dead. When her things are missing she says something like all things come back one way or another. My friend who never read the books or saw other movies though that was about the man who died.

The movie intimates that Sirius dies of the AK curse and then falls behind the curtain. Is that in the book. I will need to look it up.

Going with someone who has never participated was instructive. She too was confused as your friend was Becks. She didn't know who LV was when he appears on the train platform - she got the overall picture but found it confusing.

I am going to the imax showing of it with my kids and perhaps I will find more to love about it there. I was even disappointed in the ending fight scene between DD and LV. We don't get any sense of the specialness and complexity of the magic they use with each other. It simply looks a bit like Harry vs LV in GOF - I did think they did LV's possession of Harry at the end well. But, Harry feeling sorry for him? That comes up in book 6 and he denies it with DD in DD's office.

I can't not go to the movies but I understand your drive for that Becks. Only 8 days to go before we know the outcome - now that I can't wait for!!!
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Old 12-07-2007, 06:04   #13
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Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

I knew I was forgetting to mention some things last night when I posted . . . most of them have been mentioned by others now, but one thing . . . they didn't give the whole prophecy!!! And what they left out was the time the "One" would be born - as the seventh month ens and to those who have thrice defied Voldemort. I thought that they would give the rest with Dumbledore at the end which is where Harry was supposed to hear it anyway, but they cut that so short, the only thing he really said was that he didn't tell Harry because cared too much. And no story of Snape intruding in the middle. UGH! And I agree 100% that Harry should not have handed over the prophecy, I was absolutely shocked that Rowling would have allowed that in there!

The time line . . . you are right, they never gave any sense of it, it could have all happened in a week the way it was presented. And not only that, but many things happened out of order too.

Overall though, the movie was for me still very enjoyable, I guess because I have grown to know that any book put to film will leave one dissapointed if you expect all the favorite and "important" parts to be there. My kids who don't dig into "cannon" as I do, and just like the story of HP absolutely loved it and thought it was the greatest movie ever! It's only us hardcore fans who look for every last detail, and considering the time they have, I think they do fairly well. I do think they should have used up close to 3 hours instead of 2 hours and 20 minutes, so much more could be shown in another 30 minutes!

I have seen many movies that were made from books I loved, Stephen King, Dean Koontz, Robin Cook, Tolkien, and of course Rowling . . . of all of them (and probably others that I don't remember at the moment) have been dissapoinging but for one. When they made a 6 hour miniseries of King's short story "The Langoliers" everything was there! I loved it! (OK some of the cast didn't exactly seem to fit what I had imagined, but, that is the only complaint) But, that is the thing though . . . it was a "short story" to begin with, yet 6 hours of movie. To do that with OotP . . . a minimum of 24 hours, And that could never happen!

We just need to accept the movie as a brief representation of the "BIG" plot points in the story, and some of the other fun or exciting scenes. They did do a very good job on some important things, but we knew to start that a lot would be left out.

If you can, catch it at IMAX, it's great!
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Old 12-07-2007, 08:51   #14
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Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

I totally agree that way too much was missing form the story. I was so bummed the Snapes worst memory was reduced to a 20 second set of flashbacks. If you didn't read the book you would have no idea that it was James and company picking on Snape. I also hated how the prophecy was just handed over to Lucius so easily.

We never heard about Snape telling Dumbledore that the kids were in trouble and going to the ministry. I had to explain all that to my husband. He thought padfoot was a code-word but wasn't sure for what.

Everything moved so quickly. You blinked and you missed a line or word. I almost missed Sirius's death because I leaned over to get a drink. (Didn't care for veil either. It wasn't even a curtain.)

I didn't like Cho as the snitch and I wanted Harry to have a proper sit-down with Dumbledore and learn the whole prophecy and why it was withheld from him. To me the key points are plated out in those last moments fo the book and they should be included in the movies as well.

That said:

I loved Luna. She was just how I pictured her.

Umbridge was portryed great too.

The DA moments were fun to watch and I liked that the kids have really grown in their parts.

Alan Rickman was awesome as Snape once again.

The possession scene was done very well.

Overall I enjoyed it. I wish we had Imax where I live. I am sure it is amazing. But if you do not read the book I think you miss a lot of key things in the story
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Old 12-07-2007, 10:17   #15
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Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

Just saw the 3-D version. It's probably the best 3-D I've ever seen - except perhaps Flesh For Frankenstein. The thestrals, the MoM... yeah, the 3-d's great.

Neville looks like the chosen one though. He's got the guts, the fire, the drive to do what needs to be done.

I know they wanted us out of the cinema as soon as possible after the 3-D stuff, so we tell our friends how good it is, but the little de-briefing w/ DD, DD basically says that the prophecy says it will happen, and so it will - there was none of the Harry chosing his own destiny stuff.

There were alot of good touches - Ginny was obviously right in character the whole time. She doesn't look like Ginny though - she looks pleasantly frumpy. Ginny is sassy. The books have always hinted she is incredibly powerful, so it was good that's there.

Oh, but WHY are Luna, Neville and her in Umbridge's office? Haqve to wait for the DVD to see that scene, I guess.

Lucius was great, the Death Eater were... probably more impressive than they are in the book. More formidable. The kids look outmatrched, which is good.

Ron was really good, I thought. Sometimes though, actors looked like they had no idea why they were in a scene. Tonks was cool in the flight scene, but she looked wooden at the train station. Kingsley looked like he just didn't know why he was in this film.

I like how jealous Ron got with Grawp. He's portraying his affection for Hermione well. Ginny too, her feelings for Harry. Hermione though, had a bit of the King Kong fetish going, I think. I think she genuinely ... Nah. I'll leave it at that.
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Old 12-07-2007, 19:24   #16
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Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

Lucious materializing right in front of your face
Well, something to DEFINITELY look forward to seeing in IMAX. :P

Had to add thoughts on second viewing from last night.

First, I liked it better the second time. Already knowing the changes, you can overlook it easier somehow. And, I think the whole "Levicorpus" thing was worse b/c it was Harry who taught it to the DA in their meetings. During one of the lessons (the second, I think) -- the one where Cho is levitating Nigel -- one of the boys uses the spell by name. So, Harry taught it. I think that makes it worse!

Concerning the physical appearance of Ginny, I agree that I dislike that she was shown as "caring" so much about what Harry was doing. But, have you seen pictures of Bonnie at the premieres? CLEARLY, she is growing her hair out and she looks stunning. You almost don't recognize her. Amazing what can happen to a girl in a year and a half.

Anyhoo --- looking forward to the last book. DH only asked about the fight in the Ministry (doesn't read the books), so he seemed like he followed it okay. I think it's my fave of the series so far, but it does fall way short of the book (my least fave of the series).

Last edited by halliemei; 12-07-2007 at 19:34.. Reason: Adding new thoughts
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Old 12-07-2007, 20:31   #17
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Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

The Room of Requirement providing mistletoe was a nice touch.

But Cho should have said 'I really like you, Harry'. I like that bit.

Last edited by Dr Winterbourne; 13-07-2007 at 04:30..
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Old 13-07-2007, 05:07   #18
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Thumbs down Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

I was disappointed beyond words.....
what the heck those people at WB are thinking????
Worst plot.... Worst directing...... Worst faking.....

Ok let us discuss what was missed OR changed

- Dumbledore's Howler. (Dursleys' scenes were just joke. Horrible directing)
- Why did they show Harry pulling the wand infront of all the friends of Dudley?
- Tonks hair were so not bubblegum pink
- All the important scenes cut from Grimmauld place, including locket and all that.
- Kreacher looked like some missing senior citizen from local nursing home.
- Grimmauld place looked like some drug lab in appartment community, rather than a Grim Old Place that we have been pictured in books.
- Room of requirements was not found by Nevile, it was Dobby. And even the way they showed it was just bizzare. Nevile just walked by wishing something once (not three times) and the room was just there.
- DA meetings were crunched up, and spell work was just awful. the wand movement was not there, they were all over the place with wand.
- What happened to the quidditch?
- The lessons with Snape looked more like Detention to me.
- Where the heck was swamp that Weasleys created?
- Where the heck was the scene where Minerva runs to save Hagrid and all those attacks by Aurors?
- Ministry battle was just one HOCUS POCUS. Honestly, Voldemort looked more impressive and powerful than Dumbledore.
- Why the heck they showed DD and Tom's wand connect? Where were the golden statues that were supposed to be protecting Harry, and DD? Where was the phoenix.
- They showed Bellatrix curse Avada Kedavra to Sirius (completely bizzare), but they showed not once Voldemort throwing Avada Kedavra to DD?????

I liked the ministry battle only because I saw it in 3D in IMAX. For those of you that havent seen the movie in IMAX, please do not miss it.
The Veil was awesome.

Those who saw the movie without reading the book, I bet are scratching their heads now, and may not come back for movie 6.
I hope that leading sites like mugglenet and leaky cauldron can strike a protest against WB killing the series like this by making mockery of the books.

I hope JKR comes to her senses and finally do something about this mess.

I am one sad fan today...........

Over all grade to the movie..... C-
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Old 13-07-2007, 05:41   #19
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Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

CC, I get that they have to cut some things. But to cut things that we know are central to the story line ie: locket, howler to petunia (we know there is more to her from JKR), mirror given by sirius (JKR has said it comes back), Minerva battle reinforces Harry's aloneness which was one of the central points of the movie - why cut that. I thought I was the only one who didn't like the final fight scene. Ok, so they cut brain room and love room and time room but to hand Lucius the prophesy and the fight between DD and LV so lame - no special spells??? I did like the posession part though, except where Harry says he feels sorry for LV - so not canon.
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Old 13-07-2007, 05:54   #20
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Re: OotP - Spoiler - MAJOR Canon Problem

i don't know whether i feel better or worse hearing everyone else's opinions on it!

each time i come back here, someone has posted something else i forgot or missed!

i was left confused when Neville found the room of requirement! HOW did he do it? all i saw was him walking past, the door appeared, then he walked back to it. did he say something that i missed?

and filch waiting outside it? okay, that was funny....

did anyone else notice the cat in the plate in Umbridge's office? the one that in the book, harry looks at and it reminds him of Moody? the movie suggests that it was a lookout for Umbridge! Where was the veritaserum, apart from when we hear about it when they admit to Cho having had some (i DO NOT agree with them having her as the sneak, and then only because of the Veritaserum, it leaves it open for her and Harry to reconcile).

i posted a comment on IMDB. after someone else said the movie was fantastic and the best yet.
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