Snape and the imperius curse

The Frozen North · 27-08-2005, 01:04

Maybe I'm being a bit slow hear (it hapens on occasions

) but is it possible that Snape was acting under the imperius curse when he killed DD? I know there are alot of details to fill in if this is the case but I'm sure a good argument could be built for this case (if it's not already been discussed).

***Alz*** · 27-08-2005, 02:07

Ummm ...

It would be a contradiction to the dichotomy of one Severus Snape.
JKR has built Snape up to the point we left him in HBP - the guy is an enigma wrapped in a mystery.
I'm inclined to believe he is acting under his own control - to the point he is very aware of where he was sitting as the double agent - and in fact isn't loyal to anyone other than himself.

If he was placed under Imperius by Voldemort - this would assume that Voldemort didn't trust him - this isn't a far shot of the imagination as we know Voldemort doesn't trust anyone really ...
I feel thou that the key to Snape is once again choices - and in his respect he is all about his own choices and not those of people around him - I think he manipulated both parties - played a very dangerous game - but the one thing he does seem to have is a level of trust on both opposing parties.
While I am not prepared to all out dismiss it - I think he is more inclined to the 'good' side after what he did in his past - I think him killing Dumbledore took something more than what it appeared - no matter what he felt of Dumbledore he had been in his service for 16 years and was actually trusted and respected for the first time in his life ... I wonder if it actually took the Imperius curse to make him take the last steps he did with Dumbledore ...

Piper · 27-08-2005, 06:10

I think Snape has too much mind control for the imperius curse to work on him.

Remember in GoF, both of the Crouch's were able to fight the imperius curse, first the son, when he stoled the wand and set the dark mark off, and then the father, they stopped letting him go to the office when he was able to fight it, and he even escaped and went to Hogwarts while under it. I have considered this too. I thought maybe that was why Wormtail was with Snape, but that would make very little sense as Voldermort thinks Wormtail was careless with Mr Crouch and let him excape in GoF, so I doubt he would have trusted him with Snape.

The Frozen North · 27-08-2005, 06:44

I had thought of Snape being able to fight the imperius curse but IF he was under the curse it depends on how long, it clearly takes even accomplished wizards such a the Crouch's time to start to break the curse. The fact that Harry did it in such a short space of time during DADA classes in GoF is just another testament to Harry's determination. He may lack a diciplinned mind but he is extreemly determined.

***Alz*** · 28-08-2005, 02:29

You don't think that Dumbledore did it to ensure that Snape performed the task at hand?

Snape might have been wavering slightly - Dumbledore did it to ensure there was no hesitancy.
Good thing about that is - if Snape could prove it to Harry - he still might be able to show all he did was to help Harry ...

Piper · 28-08-2005, 22:22

Quote:

The fact that Harry did it in such a short space of time during DADA classes in GoF is just another testament to Harry's determination. He may lack a diciplinned mind but he is extreemly determined

While I do think that Harry is determined, you have to remember that it was Barty Crouch acting as Mad-Eye in that scene in GoF, not the real Mad-Eye. It's hard to guess how hard Barty tried, he could have been just testing Harry, or trying to build false confidence in Harry. Chilling when you reread that knowing who he really is, one that helped torture Nelville's parents, then there he is discussing it with poor Nelville

Fortescue · 29-08-2005, 02:20

I've been trying to find a quote as I think I recall somewhere that Harry was told the skill it takes to fight the Imperius Curse is the same skill required to do Occlumency. (I just can't remember where I read it!)

Anyway, if that is the case, then it would be nearly impossible to put someone under the Imperius Curse who can perform Occlumency. In other words, it would be nearly impossible for anyone to use the Imperius Curse on Snape or Dumbledore, and probably most of the Death Eaters. Snape would have those defenses in place to fight the curse, and if Voldemort does indeed teach his Death Eaters Occlumency, as has been assumed by Bellatrix's statement in the chapter, Spinner's End, and that might be where Snape learned it as well, then Voldemort would know that Snape couldn't be controlled with the curse.

Ana C.B.Rodrigues · 02-03-2006, 08:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alz

Ummm ...

It would be a contradiction to the dichotomy of one Severus Snape.
JKR has built Snape up to the point we left him in HBP - the guy is an enigma wrapped in a mystery.
I'm inclined to believe he is acting under his own control - to the point he is very aware of where he was sitting as the double agent - and in fact isn't loyal to anyone other than himself.

If he was placed under Imperius by Voldemort - this would assume that Voldemort didn't trust him - this isn't a far shot of the imagination as we know Voldemort doesn't trust anyone really ...
I feel thou that the key to Snape is once again choices - and in his respect he is all about his own choices and not those of people around him - I think he manipulated both parties - played a very dangerous game - but the one thing he does seem to have is a level of trust on both opposing parties.
While I am not prepared to all out dismiss it - I think he is more inclined to the 'good' side after what he did in his past - I think him killing Dumbledore took something more than what it appeared - no matter what he felt of Dumbledore he had been in his service for 16 years and was actually trusted and respected for the first time in his life ... I wonder if it actually took the Imperius curse to make him take the last steps he did with Dumbledore ...

Well done... I totally agree with that, besides, as everyone knows Snape was very good at school doing nonverbal spells and is a good occlumens so he has a lot selfcontrol. It would be impossible to Voldemort to Control him.
Remomber he had a big deal trying to control Harry... would he be strong enough to control Snape...?